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Football Player Logic: ‘Not-No = Yes’

Can you imagine standing in a courtroom making this argument on behalf of your client, a high school football player accused of raping a drunk girl? [1] Excerpt:

Associate Attorney General Marianne Hemmeter told the judge at a hearing in October that the Weirton teen was clearly too drunk to agree to sex.

“The state doesn’t have to prove that she was flat-lined,” Hemmeter said. “Everybody agrees she’s puking. She’s puking on herself. People have to help her walk. She can’t talk. She’s stumbling.”

Attorney Walter Madison, who represents one of the accused boys, contends the girl voluntarily drank and willingly left in a car with a group of boys — including the two charged football players.

“There’s an abundance of evidence here that she was making decisions, cognitive choices,” Madison said. “She didn’t affirmatively say no.”

She didn’t affirmatively say no.  That’s really something.

In case you’ve forgotten, here’s a reminder of what a class act [2]those Steubenville High football players are.

UPDATE: From a commenter:

I was on a jury for a case like this once. (Only one guy, though, and the girl was 19.) The thing was, the other members of the jury were all in favor of the guy. They felt it was the girls fault that she got into the situation. Though the law was clear, and the judge explained that to us clearly, as soon as we were in the jury room guys would be saying, “I’ve done that, gotten a girl drunk to have sex with her” and women saying, “I’ve been that drunk, and nobody but me was responsible for the things I did.” Though the prosecution’s lawyer was brilliant, much better than the defense,the jury let the guy off, because they didn’t want anyone to pass judgement on their own similar behavior.

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80 Comments To "Football Player Logic: ‘Not-No = Yes’"

#1 Comment By EliteCommInc On March 12, 2013 @ 9:38 pm

Elizabeth Anne

excuse the delay . . .

#2 Comment By EliteCommInc On March 12, 2013 @ 9:56 pm

Elizabeth Anne,

if you had identified this specific group and their specific comments, I would have had a context. Failing such criterea or frame. Your comments were wide open and I could be wrong but it certainly seemed deliberate. You subsequently articulated the matter in specifics. That said a rather bland response. I have no idea what your height or shoe size are. As I made clear, in cases of behavior, the sexual biology is unimportant as to the matter.

Rape, if said occurred is a personal, social and legal afront. Whether they are actually guily of rape is another matter despite their commentary. Internal guilt of a thing does not neccessarily make one guilty of what one may feel guilty about. They may in their minds feel they have crossed the line, but whether they crossed a legal line is another matter.

And as for the monicker of sexual predator, you may be entitled to your opinion, but your opinion should be based on some standard of definition. Never so telling as the “I am entitled to my opinion prosecution.”
So a seriel dater, who engages in relations is that person a sexual predator, or does the nature of the relations matter?
Before we get too far with this:

Definition
In the broad sense of the word, sexual predators are people who commit sexual crimes. The term “predator,” however, usually indicates a repeat offender who enjoys the feeling of “hunting down” his prey. Many sexual predators attack only a particular type of victim, such as children of a certain age, sex or race. Sexual predators are usually friendly, self-assured individuals who target their victims carefully, rather than choosing at random. I don’t like web cite references, but this will do.

Definition

In the broad sense of the word, sexual predators are people who commit sexual crimes. The term “predator,” however, usually indicates a repeat offender who enjoys the feeling of “hunting down” his prey. Many sexual predators attack only a particular type of victim, such as children of a certain age, sex or race. Sexual predators are usually friendly, self-assured individuals who target their victims carefully, rather than choosing at random.
[3]

So which application here is appropriate? Your bland reference includes anyone who manipulates to obtain sexual favors — that;s huge net, completely emptying the meaning of the term. But as you say, you are entitled to your opinion. Hence the term predator — usually a sign of more than once . . . just how many times have they engaged in said behavior and just who were their targets?

#3 Comment By Chris 1 On March 12, 2013 @ 10:07 pm

There was a time in America when driving drunk was just something that happened, what resulted from driving drunk was “accidental” and resulted in a slap on the wrist or less because “everyone does it.”

Then came MADD.

What’s needed is a MADD for rape. Sounds crazy, but without it what’s always going to be is “it’s the victim’s fault, she should have known better, boys will be boys.”

Just like drunk driving.

#4 Comment By EliteCommInc On March 12, 2013 @ 10:08 pm

JonF,

your response is exactly my point. There are still people who chaperone. And by golly gee wow, bully for them. That a couple meet within the context of a gathering of freinds and/or relatives is no crime. Is no deterrent to a successful relationship . . . confining perhaps. But it does not have to be so . . .

What a glib response missing the point. First, that will be a matter between myself, my wife and my child as so expressed. Second, given the state of relationships, marriage, and life among HS, College and University students . . . the women alone thing seems to have increasing problems . . .

To wit, perhaps, you haven’t noticed: Bicycles are quite popular. And great fun to ride. And horse and buggy rides these days come equipped with a driver.

That you should have an issue with my choice to be a part of the introductory portion of my child’s relationship so as to set tone and provide cover for both —

— is quite liberal. And good greif is correct, I prefer a little and temporary discomfort of my presence and my wifes in those initial stages. As opposed to the increased liklihood of a visit to a rape crisis clinic or something similar . . .

Excuse me . . . my horse and buggy await.

#5 Comment By EliteCommInc On March 12, 2013 @ 10:14 pm

Grumpy realist,

I did not say that it was a definite . . . it was included in a long list of potential indicators of behaviors which might include a yes. And certainly, deciding to have drinks might very well be interpretted as a yes to something else. I find your assumptions about the nature of nterpersonal exchange possibilities —

Godlike . . .

#6 Comment By EliteCommInc On March 12, 2013 @ 10:24 pm

Franklin Evans, excuse me my add on comment was misplaced . . . I was actually adding to Elizabeth Annes’ commentary of the extent of rape.

But I am curious Elizabeth Anne as to the data sources for this research. rape is another one of those hyper issues but it’s occurrance while tragic according to the FBI stats is small.

I have also read the research as the recency of said acts x number per minute. And the methodology and the conclusions are just unverifiable dubious speculation. No doubt someone here will make the claim that the FBI are deliberately hiding the actual number of cases.

The Justice Department numbers are also in question, because they base their results on phone surveys as of last year. Nevermind the trouble defining the term. If the judge kept the matter within juvenile jurisdiction, he made a wise choice.

Adults can’t figure out appropriate behavior —

#7 Comment By Erin Manning On March 12, 2013 @ 11:26 pm

I like the idea of a MADD-style group fighting against rape. Maybe that would get some attention.

There are a depressingly large number of men who still think that rape is a) a false charge by a woman designed to ruin a guy’s life, b) a false charge by a woman because she could have made it clearer that she meant “no” when she was saying it, c) a false charge by a woman whose drunken behavior made her fair game, or d) an actual charge by a woman who shouldn’t have been in that parking lot/stairwell/deserted spot by herself after dark, so it’s still sort of her fault it happened.

I think the reason some men think this is because they think of rape as a crime of opportunity, specifically a crime involving the opportunity to have sex with someone who doesn’t seem to want it (though she’s probably been culturally condition to act like she doesn’t want it, even though she really does–hey, who couldn’t want it with him?). But rape isn’t a crime of opportunity unless we want to promote the idea that any time women and men are in mixed company some of the women should expect that some of the men may take the opportunity to have non-consensual sex with them. It’s a crime of violence, a cowardly and disgraceful act that is, at its heart, the most unmanly thing a man can do, because real men don’t need to force women to have sex with them.

As a mother of three girls, I’m realistic enough to teach my daughters that alas, they do have to be more careful around male humans than around (most) female ones. They should avoid alcohol, even when of legal age to drink, except in the company of family and trusted friends, because (as I’ve also shown them) women get drunk more easily than men; the alcohol impacts us sooner and with greater effect, and few women really know their limits, especially when they are young. They should never leave a drink unattended while in mixed company (the prevalence and use of date-rape drugs is on the rise, sadly). They should never hesitate to ask store security or campus security (etc.) to accompany them to their cars at night, and so on.

We were watching a Korean TV show (fictional) that showed would-be “cool” guys trying to learn how to take a gun away from a potential assailant. The guys grappled for the weapon using fancy fighting moves but didn’t get anywhere; the instructor then calmly stepped in and kneed the gun-wielding “attacker” in the groin while simultaneously removing the weapon. Cautioning my girls that that move should *not* be attempted by civilians if the attacker actually does have a gun, I told them that this was an excellent way to convince an overly amorous young man that “no” means “no,” if he’s not inclined to take her words seriously–and if he’s a random attacker, they might copy the elderly lady who successfully held off an attacker by literally holding. And, er, squeezing. Till he begged her to call 911 for an ambulance for him. You understand.

In this Ohio case I think that the parents at whose houses the parties were being held ought to be charged as well. Why do we act as though parents supplying the venues for a series of drunken parties for high schoolers is a normal part of teen life? And that’s before they became almost accomplices to rape by not giving a damn about what the soused teens were up to in their homes. It’s ridiculous.

#8 Comment By Erin Manning On March 12, 2013 @ 11:29 pm

Oh, good heavens, I left off an important bit above–when I said I’ve shown my daughters the impact of alcohol on women, I’ve shown them writings, reports, scientific studies and investigative research showing these effects…giggling here at the unintended implication of what I actually wrote! No, I’ll do a lot of things for my girls, but drink to the point of intoxication as an object lesson of what not to do isn’t one of those things. 🙂

#9 Comment By KC On March 13, 2013 @ 12:47 am

There is also sometimes the presumption that females resisting male advances are only playing a game, a form of foreplay. The female really deep down wants the guy but she feels she must demur lest she seem too easy & a slut. She wants the guy to persuade her & make him work for it.

So he shows her how desirable he thinks she is by trying to wear down her resistance. He may ply her with drink to relax her, keep her from being uptight & denying what she really wants. He figures she’ll feel guilty if she gives it up too easily so he isn’t too concerned about her efforts to shut him down.

The mindset needs to be changed most of all.

#10 Comment By Hector_St_Clare On March 13, 2013 @ 1:10 am

Re: What a glib response missing the point. First, that will be a matter between myself, my wife and my child as so expressed.

Well, yes. Feel free to raise your child however you like. Don’t be surprised when she’s in college, however, if she no longer wants/needs an, uh, chaperone on her dates.

Re: They should avoid alcohol, even when of legal age to drink, except in the company of family and trusted friends,

Honestly, I’m more comfortable working on changing men’s behaviour (or more specifically, the behaviour of the small number of men who takes advantage of women) than women’s behaviour. Stopping rape isn’t really a woman’s responsibility, it’s the responsibility of, you know, the men.

#11 Comment By JonF On March 13, 2013 @ 6:13 am

Re: That you should have an issue with my choice to be a part of the introductory portion of my child’s relationship so as to set tone and provide cover for both

I did not make an issue about you doing anything. I took issue with the claim of “liberals” being responsible for any of this. That’s just political trollery. As with much of the social change in the last century or so, technology has been the wizard with the magic wand, not politics (see also: the Pill). Rod had a post up about this some time back– not directly to that point, but close to it: the “Sexual Revolution” was not a political revolution in the manner of, say, the French Revolution; rather it was a socioeconomic revolution in the manner of the Industrial Revolution involving changes that we all embraced, liberals and conservatives equally (who doesn’t like indoor plumbing?) but which had unintended consequences.

#12 Comment By Naturalmom On March 13, 2013 @ 8:50 am

Erin Manning speaks my mind. Lots of re-education and culture-changing to do around this subject.

An important note: I don’t think that teaching girls to be careful about who they drink with and where they go should be used as an excuse to make women who get raped feel like they have *any* culpability in their assault. Erin’s comments indicate that she doesn’t think that either — I’m just stating it explicitly because I think it needs to be said. Black men used to know that it was dangerous to drive through certain towns at night. (There is a great scene in the children’s book “Bud, Not Buddy” about that.) But if a man did for whatever reason, and got beat up or worse, that didn’t make the beating his fault in any way, shape or form. Same thing with rape.

#13 Comment By Frederica Mathewes-green On March 13, 2013 @ 9:44 am

Sorry I’m so late back here, and the conversation has moved on already, but to belatedly clarify: I shdn’t have said that the jury let him off, but that the other jurors — eventually, everyone but me–wanted to let him off. So it was a mistrial. The judge came in to scold us for not recognizing the plain meaning of words like “so impaired as to be unable” etc, and I nodded vigorously in a “Give it to ’em, dad!” way. Yes, was ready to knock heads together.

#14 Comment By Franklin Evans On March 13, 2013 @ 9:49 am

Parents can take a stand, and raise their sons to be the one guy at the party who steps up and says “no” forcefully, and follow it up with action.

We must not discount the peer pressure against disagreement, against failure to conform, against “prove yourself a man” fallacies.

Yes, there is a risk for that one guy in the room, perhaps a dangerous one. If we teach the ethics of the situation, the son with the moral fortitude we all hope he will have will not hesitate in the face of that risk, and do the right thing(s).

#15 Comment By Alisha On March 13, 2013 @ 10:23 am

I’m totally agreeing with Erin and NaturalMom here.

#16 Comment By EliteCommInc. On March 13, 2013 @ 10:53 am

I am quite disappointed in this enlightened crowd.

I am going to tread carefully, because the point afterall is rape. But as to chaperoning . . . there are so many forms of chaperoning and I am certainly not suggesting that chaperoning is a permanant state, of course not. Leave it the champions of ‘whatever’ to take a term and assign something silly or so extreme it’s silly.

When a person arrives over for dinner to meet anothers parents — that is a chaperoned event. Chaperoning is for the purposes of protecting both parties and setting a stage and a tone. When my child is in college . . . unless she is living in my home, it would be expectatiuon that by they achieved some sense of self that they don’t require my presence. That their choices in mate would be of a person who would not take adavantage of them. Hopefully, my daughter will adhere close to my example od abstinence such that her brian is popping on all cylidaers when she out on a date.

#17 Comment By EliteCommInc. On March 13, 2013 @ 11:03 am

That the young men she has spent time with as young woman or young man would have seen a model of marriage and relationship that they would desire the same and even something better.

That my children would strive for loving mates of character. That when the winds of desire sweep them off their feet they are not so battered out of control so as to lose control. That alcohol is not a staple part of their diet. They they are a shrinking minority in the country is a given and in that they will have to navigate their lives with the Hope and care of a Giving, forgiving, loving God and in whose care, grace and command I must ultimnately leave them.

So if part of my protection means even modeling such behavior in their early dating life as their guest on initial dates — it will be my joy and pleasure to be so honored and so to my wife I hope.

Life is so rife with pitfalls of which they will have to face alone and slip they will — tis my hope that should they slip they don’t fall. That should they fall — they don’t crack their heads.

#18 Comment By Franklin Evans On March 13, 2013 @ 11:03 am

Frederica: I am proud of you, more than words can say. What you silently said to that judge, doubled and tripled. 😀

Elite: That’s the thing, right there. We do our best to prepare our children to make good choices, reinforce them as best we can, and hope.

#19 Comment By Frederica Mathewes-green On March 13, 2013 @ 11:18 am

I actually can hold up as an example the -good- guys at the party in question. The 19 yr old had naively tossed back 7 double lemon drops, at an afternoon outdoor party of some soldiers who lived in the apartment complex where she lived with her big sister (at work). Became very sick, and a nice guy from the party took her upstairs and held her head while she vomited. Then one of the other guys came to tell him it was time to leave for dinner. He took over with the sick girl while the good guy went to clean up.

But when the rest of the group called the replacement head-holder to come down so they could leave, no reply. They went up and banged on the door but it was locked. They climbed up to the second story to bang on the glass patio door, but it was locked too. Together they were able to lift the patio door off the tracks, and rushed into the room, and found the girl, now naked, passed out completely amid incriminating evidence.

It occurred to me that I disparaged the jury, and the creep who did this, but you know what? Most of the men at the party were stand-up guys, and they did the right thing. Some parents are teaching their sons well, and some men have a natural streak of nobility. They deserve applause.

#20 Comment By EliteCommInc. On March 13, 2013 @ 11:25 am

As I said JonF,

in this instance your response is the very problem. Here we are discussing a rather tragic circumstance. And your position is criticize a tried and true method of modeling the early stages of relationships.

I am going step outside my sself here. The messages that are sent via the concept of modeling behaviors here are far beyond parents as police men. It says, that the nature of the people involved, the very act of romantic involvement is so important that even parents care as to it’s practice.

In my mind as memeory serves — dating used to b a big deal. One got flowers, one got dressed up, one took several showers . . .

How is it that our young HS men and women are drunk as though – it’s a standard of normalcy? Doesn’t anyone here find this troubling? I certainly do. And here I am going to extend the liberal turn —-

I certainly don’t want to make women feel bad. But targeting an entire population very few of whom are rapists, will be rapists, or even consider it as a possibility. And while this is nobel. It is wholly impractical. We have been targetting safe sex for more than thirty years: people still get pregnant, get venereal diseases, etc.

And it is wholly a false assumption that my communication is soley targeted to females — hence you miss the point of chaperoning. You missed the point about alcohol. Because it doesn’t matter how much you rail against rape, if alcohol is the mechanism of decreasing inhibitions — what one has learned is unuseable — because they are operating in a state of unawareness.

And the entire bent here is liberal — the single most effective step is that parents teach and model appropriate dating behavior. It will not make rapes go away. But it will give young men and women tools to escape these tragic events. As has ccurred this has turned into ohh bad bad men as opposed to sex and alcohol don’t mix.

And for the record, while, I place most of these issues on men. My suggestion to the women who have clamored to be equals, is that they take responsibility for their role in relationships. That means, acting responsibly – if you want equality in relationships — recognize that alcohol as an excuse is a sword sweeping in both directions.

Doesn’t it sdden anyone that a group of this lady’s friends saw her supposed condition and didn’t ensure she was taken home safely? That in my mind is very disturbing. I prefer pervention as opposed to an after action report of blame and recriminations.

Grumpy realist, my comment was needlessly sarcastic, excuse me, if you can — if not I understand.

#21 Comment By Erin Manning On March 13, 2013 @ 1:59 pm

Naturalmom, I agree completely with your note re: drunkenness. The only reason I think girls have to be specially taught to avoid it is because it’s arguably more dangerous for them to get drunk in a public place than for most boys to–but even that’s not always true. Truth is, male on male rape is a growing problem, alcohol is often involved, and for a man all the shame and fear about having been raped is magnified by the homosexual aspect of the rape: if the man is homosexual himself, he still doesn’t want to be raped or to be seen as a victim by predators in his community, and if he is heterosexual he may be experiencing a certain natural horror tangled up with his sexual identity and the fear that people will now believe him to be gay even if he’s not–and either of those things may make him even less likely than a female victim of sexual assault to report the crime.

I honestly think parents are failing when they don’t teach their kids: Don’t get drunk, and don’t drink to excess; don’t assume you know your limits or that you’ll be immune to peer pressure; don’t violate underage drinking laws, because there are reasons those things exist. None of that means that if your child does drink he/she ought to be considered “fair game” by rapists, but I think parents need to be clear that getting drunk in public or even at someone’s private home is a *safety* issue. You are more likely to be hurt, attacked, raped, robbed, humiliated (and given social media and the chance of one’s boss seeing something offensive that’s not an idle threat), etc. if you are drunk in circumstances where no dedicated sober person will protect you, and that’s before we even start the lectures about getting behind the wheel of a car under the influence.

KC is also onto something important here. We create “romantic comedy” situations where a woman only says “no” until she can comfortably admit that she always meant “yes,” and then we wonder why some men think that all women really do desire them no matter what they’re actually saying at the time. “No” means “no.” Startling as it is to the egos of some males, women actually do fail to desire them physically a great deal of the time, and for many women physical desire comes only after significant romantic involvement and even–dare I say it?–committment.

#22 Comment By Paul Emmons On March 13, 2013 @ 6:20 pm

>What’s needed is a MADD for rape. Sounds crazy, but without it what’s always going to be is “it’s the victim’s fault, she should have known better, boys will be boys.”

This risks being downright tautological. Is anyone going to stand up and say “I love rape?” Absurdly dualistic black-and-white thinking, and Orwellian linguistic short-circuiting in search of shock value, will only in the long run, ameliorate the word. There’s only so much variety in the freight that one word will bear before meaning breaks down.

What’s wrong with calling this case an intermediate level of offensiveness, like “sexual assault”, which is less serious than violent and sadistic persistence under protests ,but still more than a slap on the wrist? I’m sure that there are laws already in most places that allow such judgments. If such is available, and instead of using it a prosecutor chooses to overplay his hand, my verdict sitting on a jury would be “not guilty.”

#23 Comment By JonF On March 13, 2013 @ 6:27 pm

EliteCommInc

Once again, I was making no comment on how you are conducting your and your family’s life. That would be very impudent of me, and I generally avoid sticking my nose in people’s private business unless invited.
You are also ascribing normative force to my comments when in fact there is nothing but descriptive force to them.
Beyond that there is no need to continue this.

#24 Comment By Hector_St_Clare On March 13, 2013 @ 9:37 pm

Re: Don’t get drunk, and don’t drink to excess; don’t assume you know your limits or that you’ll be immune to peer pressure; don’t violate underage drinking laws, because there are reasons those things exist.

I don’t think people should really be drinking below 18, but in fairness, the drinking age of 21 is generally acknowledged to be pretty ridiculous. Most countries with much lower drinking ages have fewer problems with alcohol than we do.

I think if we encouraged men to respect it when a woman says ‘no’, and did more to use social and legal penalties against men who take advantage of women, the problem would solve itself without having to make young women cut back on their social lives and live in perpetual fear.

It’s true there are risks with drinking, but there are risks with a lot of things in life, and more importantly, *you* shouldn’t have to change the way you live your life in important ways because *other people* don’t want to obey the law. The better solution is to crack down on people who do violate the law.

#25 Comment By Hector_St_Clare On March 13, 2013 @ 9:39 pm

Re: Black men used to know that it was dangerous to drive through certain towns at night. (There is a great scene in the children’s book “Bud, Not Buddy” about that.)

Yes, which was a horrible evil which ought to have been changed, and eventually was changed. Nowadays that’s less of a problem, which is great. I don’t think that Black people should have to live their lives in fear, either, and those white people who think they’re entitled to intimidate Black men at night in the wrong part of town- or worse- out to be treated like the scum they are.

#26 Comment By EliteCommInc. On March 13, 2013 @ 9:55 pm

JonF,

Here’s the normative force,

and it is part f my wn practice personally. It is currently against the law to intoxicated in public, apparentlt these children were. The dynamic that contributed to their current mess was created by alcohol, depending on the state or their local, this may also be illegal.

There appears to have been no adult supervision of this event.

So chaperoning seems to have been quite a prper norm to dissuade the use f alcohol. To dissuade getting drunk. To dissuade an incident where several intoxicated minors from engaging in behaviors that very well may be rape, and the subsequent tragedy facing all involved,

So, my stance as to a proper protcol is certainly that adults should chaperone events in which any number of minrs are engaged. So in response to the normative standard. S to your comments, it seems a rather wise choice to hitch up the horse and buggy, gas up the old Model T, ils the chain of one’s bike slip on a helmut of the appropriate size and post haste be present s that youth are protected from harming themselves or others by inebriated choices.

That used to be the norm, fr the future of the children, you prefer be left to their own devices. Given the choices, I would say my advocacy for a chaperone is rather mild.

Because despite the fact that Nancy Holloway was 18, at a chaperoned event among her friends — inattentiveness and alcohol were partly responsible for her circumstances.

Belabouring the point: Chaperones should in fact be quite the norm for minors.

#27 Comment By JonF On March 14, 2013 @ 6:25 am

EliteCommInc

You did not quote anything I had written. So I have to assume to are carrying on a debate with the wrong poster.
Once again I am not criticizing you or how your family conducts itself, just observing how our culture works and advancing a hypothesis as to how that came to be.

#28 Comment By EliteCommInc. On March 14, 2013 @ 10:06 pm

I am going to continue to take the high road here.

JonF, stated,
“You are also ascribing normative force to my comments when in fact there is nothing but descriptive force to them.”

Now in my understanding of normative, a rough guess here (as you provided no exampe of what you meant) is that you are suggesting that the norm is different than my position.

I have moved beyond your response to my private choice and addressed your normative force contention —

So my above comments are in line with your comments. And they address my persona standard and that which best serves teenagers as to their safety. You introduced the normative force — I addressed it. And I did so in full comprehension that my bike, horse and buggy are quite up to the task.

#29 Comment By EliteCommInc. On March 14, 2013 @ 10:08 pm

Ohhhh did I neglect to emphasize that chaperones are certainy appropriate at teeen events and gatherings . . . be it my child or someone else’s.

#30 Comment By Carol On March 19, 2013 @ 2:05 pm

Rod, now that these two boys have been found guilty, maybe you can do a post about how the media (especially CNN) has been so sympathetic to these two rapists. They’ll never play football again, they’ll be in prison until they’re 21 (!), etc. I don’t remember any such sympathy toward the (white) Duke LaCrosse boys and they were actually innocent! Duke professors and many blacks in the area still think these boys are guilty of raping the black dancer/stripper. So what makes the Steubenville case different? Candy Crowley’s comments were disgraceful – no sympathy at all toward the rape victim. Could it have something to do with the fact that one of the Steubenville rapists is black? His father was interviewed on TV and he made more sense than the reporters. He said he wasn’t in his son’s life for many years.