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Culture War Toilet Battle

Below, a video that went up on Facebook on April 19. DO NOT WATCH THIS AT WORK. The language directed at the police is foul and abusive. But if you can handle cursing, you need to watch it. I’ll describe it below.

In the video, a very masculine-presenting teenager is asked by police to leave the women’s restroom. The person, who has a deep voice, says she’s a woman, and not going anywhere. She gets very aggressive: “I’m a f–king female. Do I have to tell you again?”

The police ask for her ID. She says she doesn’t have one.

“Then out!” says the cop. “You got no ID, then get out!”

Police forcibly remove her from the bathroom while her female companions curse them.

I saw the video on this FB page [1]. Read the comments for an example of the unshirted rage of these people.

Now, this put-upon lesbian sounds like a male. She’s dressed like a male. She moves like a male. It is more than reasonable for the police to assume upon looking at her and listening to her that she’s a male. That’s why they asked her for ID. If you were one of those police officers, you would have done the same thing — and when the alleged lesbian got mouthy and refused to produce an ID, you would have removed her from the public toilet. Otherwise, you might have let a man stay in the women’s bathroom — a public toilet — making women who didn’t know this person was a lesbian very uncomfortable, and even make them feel unsafe.

And for that matter, how can we be sure that this person is a female, as she claims, and not a biological male who is feeling gender fluid  [2]that day, and identified as a woman … despite having a penis?

Of course this toilet is the Edmund Pettus Bridge of the SJWs.

I don’t know where this incident occurred, but let’s say it happened in a state that had a law giving people access to whichever toilet they wanted to use. If the alleged lesbian in this case had actually been a man who wanted to hang out in the women’s restroom, what grounds would uncomfortable females using that restroom have had for calling the police? And what grounds would the police have had for removing the male, or “male,” from the premises, as long as he/she wasn’t harassing people? If you’re a woman, would you feel comfortable using a restroom if a tall, big man — or someone who looked and sounded like a man — was hanging out there? Would you call the cops? Or would you stifle your concern, assuming that a) you must be some kind of bigot, or b) you don’t want to call the cops and then find out that that person has a right to be there, because even though that person might be a biological male, he identifies in that moment as a woman?

If you’re a cop, do you really want to risk a possible civil rights harassment complaint by getting involved in a mess like this?

This country is crazy. It is instructive to read that Facebook page, and to see how berserk so many of those on the cultural left are — as if the cops had behaved like stormtroopers instead of like reasonable people trying to protect the public safety.

UPDATE: Read what I actually wrote, people, before you comment. If this person really is a female, then of course she was in the correct bathroom. None of us know why the cops were called there. I presume because some women who had been using that bathroom thought there was a man standing in line. It’s a reasonable conclusion given how the person dressed, sounded, and presented. But assuming she is a female, how are the cops supposed to know this, absent her showing her ID? In any case, my point is not that she shouldn’t have been in this bathroom, but that if laws are passed giving people the right to use whichever gendered bathroom they want to, a woman using that public bathroom who felt afraid because a man was hanging out there would have no grounds to go to the police, nor would the police have much incentive to enter the bathroom, unless there was solid evidence of a real threat. Maybe living with that degree of social anxiety is worth it to you so transgenders, genderfluids, genderqueers and all the rest can pee wherever they like, whenever they like. But it’s a big damn ask for women. — RD]

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158 Comments To "Culture War Toilet Battle"

#1 Comment By globaleyes On April 24, 2016 @ 4:55 pm

“Most MTF transgendered persons would not raise eyebrows in a woman’s washroom.”

= LIE

Most MTF transgendered persons are not the ‘hollywood type’ with tons of plastic surgery, excellent make up and 6 digit wardrobe. Most transsexuals look like man in drag.

Can you seriously look at Bruce Jenner and say you’d confuse him for a woman?

#2 Comment By panda On April 24, 2016 @ 5:24 pm

““Do not like” does not equate to “feel threatened by,” except in some pro-LGBTPDQBVDWTF la-la land. To paraphrase someone (Colin Powell?), men don’t like to pee with men who like to pee with men.

So, in short, trans people should not pee with women, because they are potential rapists.
They also should not pee with men, because men don’t like men who like to pee with men.

But, yeah, your concerns about the issue all stem from your concern with cosmic harmony!

#3 Comment By EngineerScotty On April 24, 2016 @ 11:10 pm

Most MTF transgendered persons are not the ‘hollywood type’ with tons of plastic surgery, excellent make up and 6 digit wardrobe. Most transsexuals look like man in drag.

Can you seriously look at Bruce Jenner and say you’d confuse him for a woman?

Last I checked, Jenner was a “Hollywood type”, with a rather sizeable fortune, and access to the best of cosmetic medicine. And yet she still looks like a man in drag, when not photoshopped by the good folks at Vanity Fair.

But your observation is textbook [3]–the transfolk you notice are the “ugly drag queens” and such; so you assume that all transfolk are similarly conspicuous. You have doubtless encountered many more transfolk who you took little notice of, assuming that they were cisgenders, as there was no visible evidence otherwise.

#4 Comment By globaleyes On April 25, 2016 @ 6:49 am

“But your observation is textbook survivorship bias–the transfolk you notice are the “ugly drag queens” and such; so you assume that all transfolk are similarly conspicuous. ”

What part of ‘you cannot change your voice’ you have problem understanding?

The far majority of transexuals look like men in drag. The transexuals post-op with years and years of hormones and a reasonable plastic surgery and a low profile attitude might pass, but this latter group amounts to 1% of the whole.

There is also to say that a lot of feminized transexuals tend to over-do in a way that a normal woman wouldn’t. You can always spot a transexual because of the over the top make up, hair, clothing selection and mannerism.

Even the ones that might pass as women, they ruin everything by turning themselves into a caricature of a woman. Which is something offensive in itself.

The bathroom is also a place where normal women put the make up on. I guess looking at one transexual without make up would definitely show that they are men.

It is evident that people like you have a sexual fetish of transexuals. The only ‘men’ that were so convinced of the idea that transexuals were better looking women that normal women were usually the types paying for transexual prostitutes.

Go on with your silly leftwinger tactic, here is the beautifully written anger scale of lefwingers by Eric Manning.

The mental contortions by leftwingers would be comical if they weren’t tragical.

(I paste since I am not able to link the reply alone)

We are in the first stage of what I call (with apologies to Kubler-Ross) the five stages of progressive indoctrination on the transgender issues: denial. Here’s how all five look; I expect our country will hit stage 2 within a year or so, and the rest within a ten-year timeline (and that’s being generous):

1. Denial. “No transgender man has ever attacked a woman in a bathroom or private space, and no sexual pervert has ever pretended to be a woman or taken advantage of open bathroom laws to attack women!”

2. Anger. “Why are you bringing up links to stories showing that women have in fact been attacked in these situations? You don’t really care about women–you’re just bigots.”

3. Bargaining: “Okay, so open bathroom and private area laws might make women less safe. So what? These incidents are still really rare. Transgender rights are more important than some tiny handful of women who might have to deal with a creep in the bathroom every now and then. Women are tough; you can handle it.”

4. Defensiveness: “No, we’re not happy that the rates of attacks on women in private spaces have risen since open bathroom (etc.) laws passed. But let’s not make the “post hoc, ergo propter hoc” fallacy. There are other reasons why women are being attacked in bathrooms and private areas. Maybe women just need to put their cellphones and cosmetics away and pay attention to their surroundings when they use public bathrooms or locker rooms. If you want total safety, stay home!”

5. Historical revision: “Women have *always* been unsafe in public bathrooms and changing areas. It’s just the nature of those spaces that they’re not terribly safe, like dimly lighted stairwells and streets in bad neighborhoods. History shows us that women have always carried personal weapons such as long hatpins (back in Grandma’s day) or mace whenever they couldn’t avoid using a public bathroom or changing room. Of course, a lot of it is panic. Fewer women were attacked in bathrooms or changing rooms last year, 2020, than any time in the last three years, showing that the new, 2019 public safety measures such as camera drones are working (and, yes, it’s unfortunate that someone hacked a fitness center’s drone camera and put the video stream of women getting into their bathing suits on the Internet, but the courts agreed that the women in question weren’t actually harmed, and we all know that inmates and others do better when they have access to mild forms of free pornography like this anyway, so what’s the big deal?). Besides, this is old news. The real question is why public schools are being so bigoted about not accommodating the bathroom needs of transpecies kindergartners. Playground sandboxes are not made unsanitary because one five-year-old nongendered human/kitten has to pee in it once a day! Xe probably cleans up better than most of xem classmates…”

#5 Comment By Rob G On April 25, 2016 @ 8:14 am

“So, in short, trans people should not pee with women, because they are potential rapists.
They also should not pee with men, because men don’t like men who like to pee with men.”

Uh, no. I was merely stating that the reasons differ as to why women wouldn’t want to share a bathroom with a trans-male, and why a man wouldn’t. A woman could, in fact, feel threatened while most men would not.

That’s why this is primarily about males in women’s rooms, and not the other way around.

#6 Comment By JasonL On April 26, 2016 @ 9:32 am

I’m sorry but I understand the rage on this one. You’re not allowed in the bathroom if you don’t look the way the police deem appropriate? They can just go in and ask for your identification because you don’t “look right?” That’s government overreach too if I’ve ever seen it. If my daughter had been kicked out of a bathroom for wearing the clothes she wanted to wear I’d be furious

#7 Comment By George On April 27, 2016 @ 5:59 pm

Below is the complete lack of logic that pretty much incapsulates the level of intelligence of bigotry.

Where the hell do you think Jenner got her surgeries? A back alley in the Philippines?

There are some women that are less feminine than others. There are some men that are more feminine than others. And none of it should dictate who gets to use a bathroom and who doesn’t. Let alone having to provide ID.

What exactly do you think would have happened if that woman in the video flashed her vagina at the cops? What other things could she do to prove she’s a woman? Show a pay stub proving she makes less than her male counterparts? Perhaps cook and clean for the officer? Oh I know, maybe pull out her copy of the Bridgette Jones Diary?

It’s pretty sad that no one is around to protect citizens and their rights. If only there was an organization to do that. Maybe we can come up with a group of men and woman who can police areas and keep the peace. Maybe protect and serve.

globaleyes says:
April 24, 2016 at 4:55 pm
“Most MTF transgendered persons would not raise eyebrows in a woman’s washroom.”

= LIE

Most MTF transgendered persons are not the ‘hollywood type’ with tons of plastic surgery, excellent make up and 6 digit wardrobe. Most transsexuals look like man in drag.

Can you seriously look at Bruce Jenner and say you’d confuse him for a woman?

#8 Comment By Chris On May 10, 2016 @ 10:13 am

Globaleyes:

There is also to say that a lot of feminized transexuals tend to over-do in a way that a normal woman wouldn’t. You can always spot a transexual because of the over the top make up, hair, clothing style and mannerism.”

I was watching a documentary about the Holocaust recently, and there was a line from a Nazi propaganda text book: “You can always spot a Jew by their large nose.”

Your statement reminded me of that.

“It is evident that people like you have a sexual fetish of transexuals.”

And this sounds like pure projection. You’re the one who just spent paragraphs talking about the physical appearance of trans people, in addition to referring to them by the outdated term “transsexual” (indicating your preoccupation with their sexualities).