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	<title>Comments on: Still Taking Exception (II)</title>
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	<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=still-taking-exception-ii</link>
	<description>n. the principle of good order&#60;br /&#62;&#60;br /&#62; "Observe the strange inversion of all order and sense! Dignity debased; how vilely is the function of a consul prostituted!" ~The Craftsman</description>
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		<title>By: Gordianus</title>
		<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-35774</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordianus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 01:27:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=10957#comment-35774</guid>
		<description>Conrad Black (writing from prison?) has an interesting rejoinder to Lowry and Ponnuru in todays NR online.  Good for him.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Conrad Black (writing from prison?) has an interesting rejoinder to Lowry and Ponnuru in todays NR online.  Good for him.</p>
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		<title>By: Gordianus</title>
		<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-35773</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordianus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:01:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=10957#comment-35773</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s a sad country who&#039;s populace doesn&#039;t think of itself as exceptional.  Attacking any notion of American Exceptionalism is bad politics because it is perceived as undermining the public&#039;s love of country.  Better to define it in better, less easily manipulated terms.

Many people do sense something alien in Obama but are too quick to impute all sorts of impulses and ideologies with no proof of same.   Personally, I doubt that he has the sort of feeling toward our country and its traditions that I do.  I wish he had said something better in response to Chavez.  I would have said, &quot;Sorry we failed the Cuban people.  They suffered decades of oppression because of it.&quot;  Then up close in a whisper, &quot;If you make us come for you little man, I promise you we will make a good job of it.&quot;  Followed by a warm pat on the shoulder for the cameras.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a sad country who&#8217;s populace doesn&#8217;t think of itself as exceptional.  Attacking any notion of American Exceptionalism is bad politics because it is perceived as undermining the public&#8217;s love of country.  Better to define it in better, less easily manipulated terms.</p>
<p>Many people do sense something alien in Obama but are too quick to impute all sorts of impulses and ideologies with no proof of same.   Personally, I doubt that he has the sort of feeling toward our country and its traditions that I do.  I wish he had said something better in response to Chavez.  I would have said, &#8220;Sorry we failed the Cuban people.  They suffered decades of oppression because of it.&#8221;  Then up close in a whisper, &#8220;If you make us come for you little man, I promise you we will make a good job of it.&#8221;  Followed by a warm pat on the shoulder for the cameras.</p>
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		<title>By: RedPhillips</title>
		<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-35764</link>
		<dc:creator>RedPhillips</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:27:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=10957#comment-35764</guid>
		<description>This kind of American exceptionalism world policeman interventionist nonsense can not be squared with constitutionalism. And you don&#039;t even have to be an ultra-orthodox Ron Paul style constitutionalist to understand this. Mere rhetorical commitment to the Constitution and limited government and any sort of level-headed realism rules this out. I think Lowry and Ponnuru realize they are losing their grip. That is why they are just amping up the rhetoric.

The irony is that &quot;pragmatic&quot; party people like L and P finger wage at people like me who refused to support McCain and ramble on about following the Constitution as originally intended as hopeless ideologues, but it is hard to conceive of anything more hopelessly windmill jousting than their Pax Americana fantasies. Babbling about making the world safe for democracy is at least as impractical and ideology laden as is your average Paul supporter’s constitutionalist rhetoric.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This kind of American exceptionalism world policeman interventionist nonsense can not be squared with constitutionalism. And you don&#8217;t even have to be an ultra-orthodox Ron Paul style constitutionalist to understand this. Mere rhetorical commitment to the Constitution and limited government and any sort of level-headed realism rules this out. I think Lowry and Ponnuru realize they are losing their grip. That is why they are just amping up the rhetoric.</p>
<p>The irony is that &#8220;pragmatic&#8221; party people like L and P finger wage at people like me who refused to support McCain and ramble on about following the Constitution as originally intended as hopeless ideologues, but it is hard to conceive of anything more hopelessly windmill jousting than their Pax Americana fantasies. Babbling about making the world safe for democracy is at least as impractical and ideology laden as is your average Paul supporter’s constitutionalist rhetoric.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Sullivan</title>
		<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-35751</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Sullivan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 02:46:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=10957#comment-35751</guid>
		<description>Their arguments on mass transit just get weirder and weirder.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Their arguments on mass transit just get weirder and weirder.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Dooley</title>
		<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-35750</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Dooley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 01:41:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=10957#comment-35750</guid>
		<description>&quot;Americans affirm a creed that upholds “liberty, equality (of opportunity and respect), individualism, populism, and laissez-faire economics.” 

This is spewing.  It is neither right wing, nor left wing. It is sophomore year civics mush. Would Lowry and Ponnuru have had Obama plunge his face into this mush before answering Ortega, and to what end?  So that he could then launch himself into some blab about how America has moved on to other excellent adventures from what everyone with a brain concedes was a misbegotten, juvenile, mismanaged, historic screw up, distinguished in its planning by nothing whatever but good intentions (sound familiar). &quot;You are aware, Mr Ortega, of the tenets of the American Creed, which has since established our exceptionalability, and that you are, alas, an unexceptional piece of s....&quot;
The fact of the matter is that Lowry and Ponnuru in their blab talk come very close to investing the federal government with divine right to remake the world in the image of our constitution; in the meanwhile, they don&#039;t trust it to regulate Goldman Sachs.  The Chinese would call that a contradiction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Americans affirm a creed that upholds “liberty, equality (of opportunity and respect), individualism, populism, and laissez-faire economics.” </p>
<p>This is spewing.  It is neither right wing, nor left wing. It is sophomore year civics mush. Would Lowry and Ponnuru have had Obama plunge his face into this mush before answering Ortega, and to what end?  So that he could then launch himself into some blab about how America has moved on to other excellent adventures from what everyone with a brain concedes was a misbegotten, juvenile, mismanaged, historic screw up, distinguished in its planning by nothing whatever but good intentions (sound familiar). &#8220;You are aware, Mr Ortega, of the tenets of the American Creed, which has since established our exceptionalability, and that you are, alas, an unexceptional piece of s&#8230;.&#8221;<br />
The fact of the matter is that Lowry and Ponnuru in their blab talk come very close to investing the federal government with divine right to remake the world in the image of our constitution; in the meanwhile, they don&#8217;t trust it to regulate Goldman Sachs.  The Chinese would call that a contradiction.</p>
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		<title>By: Rowan</title>
		<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-35749</link>
		<dc:creator>Rowan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 00:09:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=10957#comment-35749</guid>
		<description>The annoying thing about those absurd historical claims (slavery? hello?) is that America does have a great deal of history to be proud of by these style of rankings. First nation founded on the principles of classical liberalism, arguably the most successful revolution against tyranny in history, no coups, a generally stable political system, and a Constitution and Declaration of Independence which acted as an inspiration worldwide.

Ridiculous hyperbole declaring us the freedomiest country ever instill eyerolling or cheering, not understanding and application. Acknowledging the dark past of the nation isn&#039;t denigration, it&#039;s necessary to let the good bits through.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The annoying thing about those absurd historical claims (slavery? hello?) is that America does have a great deal of history to be proud of by these style of rankings. First nation founded on the principles of classical liberalism, arguably the most successful revolution against tyranny in history, no coups, a generally stable political system, and a Constitution and Declaration of Independence which acted as an inspiration worldwide.</p>
<p>Ridiculous hyperbole declaring us the freedomiest country ever instill eyerolling or cheering, not understanding and application. Acknowledging the dark past of the nation isn&#8217;t denigration, it&#8217;s necessary to let the good bits through.</p>
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		<title>By: Ken_L</title>
		<link>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/2010/03/10/still-taking-exception-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-35748</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken_L</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 00:03:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=10957#comment-35748</guid>
		<description>Lowry and Ponnuru demonstrate their deep confusion with their reference in the second piece to &#039;our (admittedly somewhat hyperbolic) claim that America is the freest and most democratic nation on Earth&#039;. 

What they actually wrote in their original essay was this: &#039;Our country has always been exceptional. It is freer, more individualistic, more democratic, and more open and dynamic than any other nation on earth.&#039;

This was not &#039;hyperbole&#039;; it was the very essence of their claim to exceptionalism. If they now characterise it as an exaggeration, they are undermining the first principles of their whole case for exceptionalism.

Then again logic has never figured as strongly as &#039;values&#039; and emotion in the world-view of many self-described conservatives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lowry and Ponnuru demonstrate their deep confusion with their reference in the second piece to &#8216;our (admittedly somewhat hyperbolic) claim that America is the freest and most democratic nation on Earth&#8217;. </p>
<p>What they actually wrote in their original essay was this: &#8216;Our country has always been exceptional. It is freer, more individualistic, more democratic, and more open and dynamic than any other nation on earth.&#8217;</p>
<p>This was not &#8216;hyperbole&#8217;; it was the very essence of their claim to exceptionalism. If they now characterise it as an exaggeration, they are undermining the first principles of their whole case for exceptionalism.</p>
<p>Then again logic has never figured as strongly as &#8216;values&#8217; and emotion in the world-view of many self-described conservatives.</p>
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