Rod Dreher

Islam, the Mideast, & Liberal Democracy

Your Big Fat Gay Oreo Cookie

By Rod Dreher • June 26, 2012, 10:29 AM

It’s not a joke: Oreos announced their support for gay pride. Jerry Falwell, you and Tinky-Winky should have lived to see this moment.

But seriously, isn’t this ridiculous? Since when does a cookie brand feel the obligation to take political stands? It’s absurd. Listen, I’m pro-life, but if Oreo announced its support for anti-abortion causes, I would find that bizarre. Likewise this. I think it’s very hard to overestimate the enthusiasm for gestures like this in corporate America. A newspaper executive once told me that if readers didn’t like the emphasis the paper he worked for put on gay-positive stories, then the paper could do without such “bigots” (his word) as readers.

So, what now? On to Chips Ahoy, which I guess must be presumed to be a vicious little Hate Biscuit until proven otherwise.

Posted in Consumerism, Culture war. Tagged gay, gay rights, Oreo.

71 Responses to Your Big Fat Gay Oreo Cookie

← Older Comments

Alex says:

June 26, 2012 at 8:53 pm

Erin: The message of gay pride is “Sodomy is the moral equivalent of marriage, and should form the basis for marriage, and anybody who disagrees is a hater hater social traitor. So all Catholics are bigots by definition.

This is an incorrect and ahistorical interpretation of gay pride’s message. Which pride event have you seen that had this as its primary message?

Pride existed as a movement before same-sex marriage was an issue and continues to exist in places like Canada where the fight for same-sex marriage is essentially over. As I said, the message of gay pride is “gay people exist and are not ashamed of existing” – that’s why it’s called “pride”, after all. That message is encapsulated in pride’s most famous chant (“We’re here! We’re queer! Get used to it!”). And the idea that pride is primarily anti-religious would certainly come as a surprise to the congregants at the Pride church service I sang at on Sunday night, and most especially to the Catholic Monsignor who sang next to me (though since he’s ECC you might regard him as a schismatic at best I suppose).

I’m not sure why you’re trying to maximize your own victimization in all cases: if a company uses Catholic imagery, it must be because they’re seeking to exploit you; if they use gay imagery, it must be because they’re seeking to attack your faith. If gay people are happy being gay, it must be because they want to silence all Catholics. Trying to discover your own martyrdom in every situation can’t be good for your heart or for your soul. Or, if I may descend into camp: honey, it’s not always all about you.

If there’s one thing that’s common to all aspects of gay pride it’s joy. Whether it’s the defiant joy of “we’re here!”; the sublime joy of singing the Hallelujah from Benjamin Britten’s “Rejoice in the Lamb” at Sunday’s Pride service; the far more earthly joy of dancing shirtless in the hot sun to loud music; the intimate joy of committing oneself to a life-long partner; or even the snarky joy Rod is finding in the idea of an openly-gay cookie – it’s all joy. During gay pride, people are constantly wishing each other “Happy Pride!” And that is a message of joy.

Erin, I sincerely wish you a Happy Pride. In this rough-and-tumble world where you can only seem to see attacks from every corner, I hope you are able to find some joy.
Roger C. says:

June 26, 2012 at 9:05 pm

Too late. Both Oreo and Chips Ahoy! are made by Nabisco, which is owned by Kraft.

Does this mean that we bigots need to stop buying macaroni and cheese?
Roger McCarthy says:

June 26, 2012 at 9:09 pm

Older Comments are still not working….
Erin Manning says:

June 26, 2012 at 9:28 pm

Gee, Alex. I appreciate the sentiment, I suppose. But you seem to be a fellow Christian–do you realize that you just wished me “Happy Chief among the Seven Deadly Sins?”

Why on earth should anybody go around mainly being proud of their sexual attractions and predilections, anyway? Is there Adulterers’ Pride Month? Or Fornicators’ Pride Month? Or Polygamy Pride Month? When do they get to celebrate their stripes in the Pride Rainbow? And, in another century or so when the age of consent has been lowered to ten or eleven, will the Pedophile Pride stripe finally be acknowledged as they, too, come out of the closet to celebrate their own special form of sexual diversity?

I guess I don’t find a lot of joy in contemplating so many members of the human family losing their way so terribly and risking eternal death over this stuff. I mean, if you’re going to be proud of your sins, and don’t believe in or care about Hell, then sin boldly! Where’s Murderers’ Pride Month? Thieves’ Pride Month? (I mean, did Jesus ever personally say that all forms of stealing are wrong? He did vaguely condemn “theft,” but that leaves out robbery and shoplifting, doesn’t it? And we can’t forget that He affirmed a thief on the Cross and told the thief he’d go to Heaven.)

What about Inside Traders’ Pride Month, or Con Artists’ Pride Month or Swindlers of Widows and Orphans Month? We’re a pretty pathetic bunch, we moderns–we want to be proud of our sins, but only those sins likely to be affirmed by mainstream multinational cookie corporations. I don’t see too many chronic self-pleasurers demanding a single-sided Oreo in their honor, or a Pride Month named for them, after all, let alone a call for “Exploiters of Undocumented Workers Pride Month” (and isn’t it fully possible to argue that those people who have so deep a love for money that they’ll break laws to get it are just born that way? It’s not like we believe that “Love of money is the root of all evil” medieval superstition stuff anymore, right?).

If we’re going to be proud of our sins, for heaven’s sake, let’s come up with some more interesting ones. I’m tired of the “gay sex is the source and summit of all that is wonderful, and anyone who disagrees is a hateful bigot!” meme behind these things; surely we could get some traction for an Assassins’ Pride Month or a Crime Syndicate Pride month to make things more interesting.

The one thing I’m sure we’ll never have in America is a Chastity Pride Month, because Americans don’t believe in chastity anymore, except as a weird aberration among the asexual or the strange religious behavior of some bitter gun and bible clingers out there.
Monterey says:

June 26, 2012 at 10:08 pm

I stopped eating Oreos awhile ago. I found out that the non-hydrogenated versions you can find in the local natural foods store tasted so much better. The last time I ate an Oreo it tasted like plastic.
Peter H says:

June 26, 2012 at 10:13 pm

Erin Manning: Or Fornicators’ Pride Month?

It’s called Spring Break. And their parade is called Mardis Gras.

They’ve also been making progress at turning Halloween into a sort of “Slut Pride” event.
John E_0 says:

June 26, 2012 at 10:44 pm

Hey guys, a very smart person has told me how to get to the old comments: use the following as a template…

http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/your-big-fat-gay-oreo-cookie/comment-page-0/#comments

obviously this will be different for each blog post. The key is the page-0 in the above example. The page numbers are zero-indexed, so a zero gets you back to the first page.

Many thanks to the mysterious H. M. Stuart of Alexandria for providing me this information.
Judith says:

June 27, 2012 at 12:16 am

Erin: “…I classify it as a grave evil along with adultery, fornication, pedophilia, and other sins of a sexual nature, because of my religious beliefs…”

I’d guess that your view is based on more than your religious beliefs. It must also be based on an your analytical conclusion that homosexuality is a choice. ?

And John E_O: Thanks, genius!
Erin Manning says:

June 27, 2012 at 1:18 am

Well, Judith, I’m agnostic about whether homosexual desires or tendencies are choices or inborn or some combination of the two (and that’s leaving aside the nature/nurture aspect of the controversy).

So the gay twin brothers who wrote to Dear Prudence in Slate may have been born attracted to the same sex, or they may not have been (I think the combination explanations make the most sense, frankly). But they certainly had the choice about whether their romantic attraction to each other necessitated incestuous sodomy and an ongoing physical partnership (and who cares if Mom, Dad, or other siblings are uncomfortable? They’re all just inhibited bigots anyway).

The point is, the man who feels sexual desire for his brother or his college roommate is no more sinful than the man who is sexually attracted to his wife’s sister. It’s what they do with that attraction that marks the difference between vice and virtue.

Of course, as I said above, in modern America the ONLY sin is the failure to act on your sexual desires providing only that the object of your lust is just as willing as you are and old enough for it to be legal, and that you pop plenty of chemical sterilizers and wrap the various body parts in latex. And then the lascivious and wanton demand applause for their bravery and courage in their choice of sex acts and partners. O tempora, o mores…
JonF says:

June 27, 2012 at 6:22 am

Re: do you realize that you just wished me “Happy Chief among the Seven Deadly Sins?”

Erin,
“Pride” is a deadly sin to be sure– the sin of Satan in fact. Yet the word “pride” in English has more than one meaning. The sin of pride, IMO, has the meaning of “arrogance” or what the Greeks called “hubris”– I am a god unto myself and am capable of everything, owing no thanks to anyone. There’s a more pedestrian, human, mundane sort of pride that is not sinful. I am proud of my garden, and of my talent for languages, and of various other gifts I have been given. You and Rod and many others are no doubt proud of your children. None of that is wrong (when not taken to excess), and if we also give thanks to God for such gifts and blessings then I do not think we are committing a deadly sin.

Also: “Why on earth should anybody go around mainly being proud of their sexual attractions and predilections, anyway?” Do you celebrate your anniversary? Did you have a party with friends and families for your wedding?

Re: They’ve also been making progress at turning Halloween into a sort of “Slut Pride” event.

Not to mention St Patrick’s Day which has become Drunk and Disorderly Pride, and Thanksgiving, Glutton’s Pride, and Christmas, Greed Pride.
Matt says:

June 27, 2012 at 8:26 am

Erin,

I don’t think you’re trolling. If you aren’t, I need to ask – you do realize that you are exemplifying virtually every negative stereotype about Christians, right?
Alex says:

June 27, 2012 at 9:35 am

Erin: Gee, Alex. I appreciate the sentiment, I suppose. But you seem to be a fellow Christian–do you realize that you just wished me “Happy Chief among the Seven Deadly Sins?”

I explained to you the sense in which I meant that greeting: I wish you joy. If you choose not to take it that way, it’s not my fault. And no, I’m not a Christian, but I am capable of being friends with Christians, accepting gracious invitations to participate in their services, and even appreciating music that happens to have been inspired by Christian belief.

Where’s Murderers’ Pride Month? Thieves’ Pride Month?

If you’re looking for a sin that might be celebrated, let’s just go for the Big One. The one truly unforgivable sin in the whole Catholic panoply is surely the denial of the divinity of Christ. Where are the store displays celebrating Passover? Why don’t we give Hindu temples the same tax breaks as Catholic churches? Why shouldn’t we recognize completely non-religious civil marriages? Why don’t we condemn as bigots the people who go out of their way to portray Christ-denial as the essence of Judaism?

Oh wait, we do all of those things. Even though denial of Christ surely risks eternal death according to Catholic doctrine.

Gay Pride didn’t start back in 1970 with universal approval from either “liberal elites” or corporate America. The fight for basic respect for basic respect for homosexuals was a long and difficult one, but one that depended on people meeting actual homosexuals and realizing that they aren’t monsters. It’s actually not that different from the history of the fight against anti-Semitism (a fight that the Catholic Church can’t pretend to have always been on savory side of). Why isn’t there an “Insider Trader’s Pride Month”? Because insider traders haven’t done the hard work to gain respect and tolerance from a plurality of the population the way that both Jews and gays have done.

The one thing I’m sure we’ll never have in America is a Chastity Pride Month,

Why not? If you want such a thing, you and people like you can surely do the hard work to gain respect for this idea. It won’t be easy, but neither was the fight for gay pride. If there ever is such an event, I’d be proud to march in the parade carrying a sign saying, “I’m gay and I love my chaste friends and family!”
ossicle says:

June 27, 2012 at 9:49 am

Huh? How is this political on the part of Oreos?

Imagine if ye olde times if a party of Artic explorers were stranded for months, then finally heroically rescued, and Oreos came out with, I dunno, a celebratory all-white cookie to symbolize the frozen tundra. That wouldn’t be political — there wouldn’t have been some immoral group who hated the explorers and though they should freeze to death.

Same thing here. To celebrate gay pride is to celebrate the ability of a group of people to live happier and fuller lives than ever before, and also to celebrate the moral advance of society; it’s purely good. Hooray for rescued explorers! Hooray for people who (increasingly) won’t be bullied or beaten to death or live their lives in secret misery any more!
Moralistic Therapeutic Deist says:

June 27, 2012 at 10:38 am

I don’t care about the politics of this, it’s too early in the morning for me to care. What I want to know is are they selling that cookie you posted a picture of?? That thing looks amazing!!
MH - Secular Misanthropist says:

June 27, 2012 at 12:54 pm

Matt, Erin’s been a contributor and guest blogger on various incarnations of Rod’s blog since the Beliefnet days. I can assure you she is not trolling and is sincere.

She and I are on opposite sides of the religiosity bell curve. For example, the word Sodomite has one meaning to her, but when I read it I think of are apocryphal tales like Jonah and the whale, trumpets knocking down walls, and people being turned into salt. Not something I take particularly seriously.
Judith says:

June 27, 2012 at 4:59 pm

Erin:
“Well, Judith, I’m agnostic about whether homosexual desires or tendencies are choices or inborn or some combination of the two”

It sounds like you are saying that this is indeed really about your religious convictions, and not about the analytical assessment that I suggested was playing a role.

Point taken. I am not a religious person.
Erin Manning says:

June 27, 2012 at 6:19 pm

Judith, honest question: if alcoholics are born with the tendency to abuse alcohol, should they fight that tendency or embrace it? Why or why not? (And no, for the umpteen millionth time, I’m not drawing a simple equivalence here. This goes more to the idea that science will eventually prove that all compulsions are the result of genetics, brain chemistry, etc., and thus not good or bad per se. At which point I will declare that I’m genetically and biochemically disposed to be a “religious bigot,” and that any attempt to “cure” me of my religion or supposed hate is against my rights.)

MH, thanks for that.

Alex, nice try, but the Church actually has some positive things to say about religious liberty (however much the SSPX dislikes that fact). Besides, do you not get the difference between having the State say that it’s not the State’s business if stores want to display both Christmas and Hanukkah stuff, and/or Easter and Passover stuff (at the appropriate seasons) and for the State to say that two men having sex is a marriage and that it’s downright un-American to believe otherwise? The one is based on tolerance and respect for religions; the other is based on the state essentially declaring that all religious beliefs are inimical to the state’s creed of secularism–which, to be fair, has been going on for a long time now.
Erin Manning says:

June 27, 2012 at 6:20 pm

By the way, YAY to the Powers that Be for fixing the Older Comments Problem!!!
CapeCodder says:

June 27, 2012 at 6:55 pm

Rod, how about answering the question(s)??

“Alex says:
June 26, 2012 at 6:26 pm

It’s pretty funny how extremely sanctimonious some are about the dang homosexual Oreo.

Rod, you kinda started it. You’re the one who tagged this “Culture war” and said that this was an example of a company taking a “political stand”. I’m serious in asking this question: can you be specific in stating what political message you think is being conveyed here?”"
Ax says:

June 27, 2012 at 9:02 pm

“for the State to say that two men having sex is a marriage and that it’s downright un-American to believe otherwise?”

Sigh.

Erin, NOBODY is saying that two men having sex is a marriage. But some are saying that two men getting married is a marriage. It’s your tendency to think that gay=sex that (justifiably, in my mind) causes people to perceive you as hateful, not your religious beliefs.
Alex says:

June 27, 2012 at 11:18 pm

Besides, do you not get the difference between having the State say that it’s not the State’s business if stores want to display both Christmas and Hanukkah stuff, and/or Easter and Passover stuff (at the appropriate seasons) and for the State to say that two men having sex is a marriage and that it’s downright un-American to believe otherwise?

Um, since when were we talking about “the state”? We’re talking about an advertising campaign by a corporation, which you somehow twisted into an attack on your faith. Why is a gay-themed ad for a cookie somehow anti-Catholic, but a Jewish-themed ad isn’t?