Rod Dreher

How Hard Is It To Run A Church?

Topless Anti-Christian Bigot Alert!

By Rod Dreher • August 17, 2012, 2:42 PM

(What an Ignatian — Reilly, I mean — pleasure it was to write that subject line!)

You probably have seen by now that the Russian feminist punks Pussy Riot got two years in the slammer for invading the Moscow cathedral and desecrating it by their obnoxious performance. That’s longer than I would have given them, and I wouldn’t have given them a minute in jail if they had done what they did outside the cathedral. But if you are going to enter a church and act like that, you had better be prepared to take the consequences. I don’t feel all that sorry for these women.

You may not have seen that a (really rather sexy) topless Ukrainian feminist and her cohorts, out of sympathy with Pussy Riot, took a chainsaw and cut down a large wooden crucifix on display in Kiev. You can watch the video here, though bear in mind that she’s topless, and this video isn’t safe for work. It is an act of shocking vandalism and anti-Christian bigotry, and, according to the feminist punks who carried it out, it was intended to be an anti-Christian statement.

Yeah, anti-Christian vandalism like this is really going to help the Pussy Riot cause in Russia and Ukraine. Idiots. To jail for you too, honey.

Posted in Religion. Tagged bigotry, Femen, Pussy Riot, Russia, Ukraine.

67 Responses to Topless Anti-Christian Bigot Alert!

← Older Comments

sjay says:

August 18, 2012 at 12:37 am

Yeah, I was aghast at the poor technique by the chain sawer. She looked like an accident about to happen the way she was jamming the saw in there.

Like others, I favor punishment against trespass and destruction of property (the same way I favor punishment of the demonstrators who lower American flags from public buildings and burn them rather than bring their own).
Charlie says:

August 18, 2012 at 2:37 am

“I am amazed by how so many commenters here think the fact that the hierarchy of the Russian Orthodox Church is, in their view, offensively close to the government justifies this hooliganism inside one of the most sacred sites in all Russia. Religious freedom is contingent on the political views of the leadership of the religion, then?”

I don’t think the prevailing sentiment in the comments is, “The Church is corrupt, therefore anything goes.” It seems to be more along the lines of acknowledging that a reasonable Russian could have reason to protest against the Church, given its relationship to the Russian government. Given the location and the nature of the protest, some sort of punishment was reasonable. Was six months in pre-trial detention, followed by a show trial, followed by two years in jail, reasonable? I don’t think that’s reasonable, and I don’t think I’m therefore indifferent to Russians’ freedom of religion.

There are two separate issues here. The first issue involves making sure all Russians can both protest against the Church and practice their religion. You can ensure that without draconian prison sentences and show trials.

The second issue involves theological questions of how blasphemy should be punished. That’s already been well covered in the comments, from all sides. But I think it’s a bit of a dodge to say that you don’t support the sentence, while also saying that you think the protestors got what was coming to them. And it’s a bit of a dodge to say the relevant crime is “hooliganism,” when all of the moral force of your argument comes from pointing out that the protest involved unacceptable behavior on holy ground. If it’s only “hooliganism” because it happened on holy ground, then you’re just talking about blasphemy by another name.
El Mono Liso says:

August 18, 2012 at 6:44 am

“Jesus, you are free to kick money changers out of anywhere else, just not in the Temple. That’s sacred ground, and you might offend a lot of people.”
Charles Cosimano says:

August 18, 2012 at 9:04 am

IT, have you ever got it wrong. If they did the nudity and sex in the US that would be ruled protected speech.

And the prosecutor would either drop the case or go into hiding as the social media would fire up the anger of their fans.
Glaivester says:

August 18, 2012 at 10:01 am

They are martyrs to their own highly unpopular cause, and in that sense, somewhat admirable in a strange way.

They are martyrs to their adolescent narcissism. That really isn’t admirable. Someone who sticks a chicken leg up their – well, the first word of their band’s name – in a supermarket would likely become a registered sex offender here in the U.S.
MH - Secular Misanthropist says:

August 18, 2012 at 10:28 am

I’m not sure being against Vladimir Putin is an unpopular cause. It is widely believed that electoral fraud was involved in his reelection:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/06/world/europe/observers-detail-flaws-in-russian-election.html?pagewanted=all

As far as the chainsaw wielding woman, she’s guilty of vandalism. But something tells me that she’ll face charges for something more severe.
John says:

August 18, 2012 at 11:36 am

It is truly shocking and saddening to see so many “freedom loving” conservative Christians line up behind the State as the enforcement arm of the Church. Much less defend the prosecution of blasphemy by a corrupt murderer! Somehow “render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s and unto God what is God’s” has become a “liberal” idea. I honestly thought you guys were better than this. If one of those dreaded “liberals” wants to say that US conservative Christians want a theocracy, all they have to do is point to this thread. Plenty here even think PR got off lightly! Jesus.

Just remember, unless you are in the majority, that power will eventually be turned against you. In Saudi Arabia, it is illegal to even own a Bible.
VikingLS says:

August 18, 2012 at 1:14 pm

John

Would you support a skinhead band invading the Holocaust Museum and playing a few songs about the evils of the Jews and the glories of the Nazis? Would I be proposing a Jewish takeover of the government if I said I hoped they threw the book at them?
VikingLS says:

August 18, 2012 at 1:16 pm

“As far as the chainsaw wielding woman, she’s guilty of vandalism. But something tells me that she’ll face charges for something more severe.”

Perhaps, but as Ukraine is an ally of the US I am skeptical that her trial will be met with the same level of outrage.
John says:

August 18, 2012 at 2:36 pm

Viking:

If the charge was blasphemy? Yes.
Lord Karth says:

August 18, 2012 at 3:21 pm

Mr. Dreher writes: “I would really be curious what you think is a reasonable penalty for their actions?

Let them go with time served.

You’re kidding, I hope.

A more appropriate punishment would have been five years’ jail time, full restitution to the church damaged, registration on whatever sex offenders’ registry is on the books over there, then exile and permanent revocation of citizenship.

Putin must be getting soft in his old age. I know I am.

Your servant,

Lord Karth
Hector_St_Clare says:

August 18, 2012 at 4:59 pm

Re: These people are paid propagandists of the West. They get some of their money from Soros, and some from the National Endowment of Democracy.Putin should let these women go with time served, but he should also get foreign political influence money out of his country. If I were Russian, I’d be in favor of confiscating every penny from the international “thinktanks” that stir this garbage up.

I agree with this totally, and couldn’t have said it any better. It’s impossible to overstate my contempt for Soros, the National Endowment for Democracy, and like-minded fools who think the rest of the world is just dying to adopt cultural-liberal American views about freedom and democracy.
Hector_St_Clare says:

August 18, 2012 at 5:02 pm

Re: It is truly shocking and saddening to see so many “freedom loving” conservative Christians line up behind the State as the enforcement arm of the Church.

You may have missed it, but I’m not a conservative, and I’ve never voted Republican in my life. My political views are hard-left on economics and most other issues, although conservative on some of the cultural issues. I’m also more skeptical than most of you, apparently, of the United States political system, and I’m extremely reticent to try and export it to other countries.
Siarlys Jenkins says:

August 18, 2012 at 8:48 pm

Chris Jones is being very European here. He is entitled to the personal opinion that blasphemy should be a crime punishable by The State, as it is in many European legal traditions, but that is not the law in the USA. For any level of government to presume to define blasphemy, let alone punish it, would be an Establishment of Religion — even if ALL blasphemy against ANY religion is punished. The legal case I referenced earlier reiterates the well established principle that no adherent of any religion is entitled to be protected from speech that offends their own religious beliefs.

There remains, of course, the fact that the punk band committed trespass, disorderly conduct, etc., which are well established crimes regardless of the religious implication. But we don’t hang people for denying the Trinity, as they used to do in Scotland and Switzerland.
Dave Dutcher says:

August 19, 2012 at 11:46 am

He is entitled to the personal opinion that blasphemy should be a crime punishable by The State, as it is in many European legal traditions, but that is not the law in the USA.

What’s funny is that if I were to describe this site’s mission, it would be to transplant European cultural attitudes and conservatism on the USA’s right. Right down to the cultural liberalism, anti-war and hard anti-immigration, and general european “no middle class” ideas of social thought.

I was puzzled at why all the hate on PR until I realized this. Like you said it’s a very European idea, and bingo. It makes sense.
Sean Nelson says:

August 20, 2012 at 3:01 pm

I am amazed by how so many commenters here think the fact that the hierarchy of the Russian Orthodox Church is, in their view, offensively close to the government justifies this hooliganism inside one of the most sacred sites in all Russia. Religious freedom is contingent on the political views of the leadership of the religion, then?

When the church and state are so thoroughly intertwined, a protest against the church is a protest against the state. Churches don’t get to have it both ways: either they stay out of the secular governing business, or they are subject to all of the speech and actions that any state is subject to. When the church allows itself to become an arm of the the state, it loses its special recognition as “sacred,” no matter how devout and noble its parishioners may be.
Atharvan says:

August 23, 2012 at 2:37 am

Gentlemen, who are talking of the “Church being interwined with State” and of “blasphemy charges” – you got it all wrong. The charge was “hooliganism”. And after the sentence was passed, the Church made a statement, calling for mercy and mitigation of the penalty.