Comments on: Maddening Men http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=maddening-men @TAC Fri, 10 Feb 2012 04:36:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Smith http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-9052 Smith Wed, 19 Aug 2009 06:49:14 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-9052 I realize that the conventional wisdom seems to put me on the wrong side of history when it comes to “Mad Men,” but just humor me for a minute. I have written before on this site about my low esteem for this show (which I would link to if I could figure out where it is, Canada!), but this love letter from the Times is so far off the mark that even if you love the show, you’ll have to grant me a few points. By Smith Onsite Manager Bull Recovery Software http://www.recoverybull.com I realize that the conventional wisdom seems to put me on the wrong side of history when it comes to “Mad Men,” but just humor me for a minute. I have written before on this site about my low esteem for this show (which I would link to if I could figure out where it is, Canada!), but this love letter from the Times is so far off the mark that even if you love the show, you’ll have to grant me a few points.

By
Smith
Onsite Manager
Bull Recovery Software
http://www.recoverybull.com

]]> By: Yet Again, We Plunge Into The Murky, Distant Waters Of The Sixties, Only To Find A Shattered Martini Glass And A Couple Lost Souls « Around The Sphere http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-9024 Yet Again, We Plunge Into The Murky, Distant Waters Of The Sixties, Only To Find A Shattered Martini Glass And A Couple Lost Souls « Around The Sphere Mon, 17 Aug 2009 19:19:46 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-9024 [...] Clark Stooksbury at TAC responds to Locklin: The only episode I remember featuring beatniks for any length of time, they seemed like jerks. How he equates “beatnik drugs” with putting condoms on Bananas for second graders; instead of say, Dylan’s Bringing it all Back Home or early Saturday Night Live episodes, is beyond me. [...] [...] Clark Stooksbury at TAC responds to Locklin: The only episode I remember featuring beatniks for any length of time, they seemed like jerks. How he equates “beatnik drugs” with putting condoms on Bananas for second graders; instead of say, Dylan’s Bringing it all Back Home or early Saturday Night Live episodes, is beyond me. [...]

]]> By: John Beeler http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8996 John Beeler Sun, 16 Aug 2009 20:54:49 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8996 I liked Locklin's article very much. Considering how much I love <a href="http://home.comcast.net/~mstrickster33/crimestory.html" rel="nofollow">this show</a>, what I read about 'Mad Men' makes me wish I had premium cable. Sure, there was hypocrisy and corruption then - fallen human nature and all that - but the world was better so there may be real nostalgia and not just hipster condescension/irony fuelling this show's appeal. Like studying Zapruder's film, watching a play-by-play of this period is a way of figuring out what went wrong; why most of it imploded and so quickly. Wrong thinking from this era produced Vatican II, exactly the wrong thing at the wrong time for the Roman Catholic Church. Funny how all the self-consciously futuristic stuff - the Jetsons look - is now quaint. Based on what I know about changes in society I thought Takimag on 'Gossip Girl' was spot-on. I liked Locklin’s article very much.

Considering how much I love this show, what I read about ‘Mad Men’ makes me wish I had premium cable. Sure, there was hypocrisy and corruption then – fallen human nature and all that – but the world was better so there may be real nostalgia and not just hipster condescension/irony fuelling this show’s appeal.

Like studying Zapruder’s film, watching a play-by-play of this period is a way of figuring out what went wrong; why most of it imploded and so quickly.

Wrong thinking from this era produced Vatican II, exactly the wrong thing at the wrong time for the Roman Catholic Church.

Funny how all the self-consciously futuristic stuff – the Jetsons look – is now quaint.

Based on what I know about changes in society I thought Takimag on ‘Gossip Girl’ was spot-on.

]]> By: Jeremiah Whitmoore http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8953 Jeremiah Whitmoore Sat, 15 Aug 2009 04:32:28 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8953 Tom, That is truly frightening. Tom, That is truly frightening.

]]> By: TomT http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8946 TomT Fri, 14 Aug 2009 21:10:51 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8946 Better get used to watching this stuff. It'll be all that's left after we get rid of "conservative" media. Check it out: http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/52435 Better get used to watching this stuff. It’ll be all that’s left after we get rid of “conservative” media.

Check it out:

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/52435

]]> By: Daniel McCarthy http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8923 Daniel McCarthy Fri, 14 Aug 2009 00:10:34 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8923 Well said, Al. Well said, Al.

]]> By: AL http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8920 AL Thu, 13 Aug 2009 23:34:13 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8920 AMC's first original series was a bland, mellow look back at 1940s radio called "Remember WENN." It was so sweet and decent and respectful of all the old verities that it was painful to watch. Matthew Weiner, who created "Mad Men" has a real love for the 1950s-1960s but he recognizes that you can't make a show out of nostalgic longings. There has to be conflict and characters have to take risks and reveal unattractive aspects of their character. The impulse behind the show is still love, rather than hate, but it's a complicated and conflicted love. "Mad Men" came along at just the right time. The idea that 50s middle class culture is threatened and needs to be defended was a potent one in conservative circles for a long time. Today, we recognize that that's the past, and we have to go on from where we are with what we have. AMC’s first original series was a bland, mellow look back at 1940s radio called “Remember WENN.” It was so sweet and decent and respectful of all the old verities that it was painful to watch.

Matthew Weiner, who created “Mad Men” has a real love for the 1950s-1960s but he recognizes that you can’t make a show out of nostalgic longings. There has to be conflict and characters have to take risks and reveal unattractive aspects of their character. The impulse behind the show is still love, rather than hate, but it’s a complicated and conflicted love.

“Mad Men” came along at just the right time. The idea that 50s middle class culture is threatened and needs to be defended was a potent one in conservative circles for a long time. Today, we recognize that that’s the past, and we have to go on from where we are with what we have.

]]> By: Lee http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8905 Lee Thu, 13 Aug 2009 18:11:35 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8905 I'm only halfway through the first season, but, if anything, it seems to me the characters are drawn so compellingly (not to mention how cool and stylish they all appear) that the greater temptation is to overlook the racism, misogyny, etc. I just watched the episdoe with the beatniks the other night and they are indeed portrayed as dumb asses. I’m only halfway through the first season, but, if anything, it seems to me the characters are drawn so compellingly (not to mention how cool and stylish they all appear) that the greater temptation is to overlook the racism, misogyny, etc. I just watched the episdoe with the beatniks the other night and they are indeed portrayed as dumb asses.

]]> By: Jack Ross http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8901 Jack Ross Thu, 13 Aug 2009 15:00:37 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8901 This reminds me of a Takimag review way back of Gossip Girl (never seen it or Madmen), in which they made such complaints about its portrayal of New York as "one couple moves from the Upper East Side to Williamsburg because its more real, when in reality a loft like there's in Williamsburg would be almost as expensive" or "the elite high schools in Manhattan are not nearly so WASP and usually half Jewish" - each of these being exactly half right, but what of it? Law and Order, I must say, is deeply flawed though enjoyable. The way they strain to portray white supremacists and Christian fundamentalists in Manhattan! Lay on top of that their absolutely stubborn refusal to portray Jews at elite high schools! Also they have a pretty lousy understanding of terrorism. This reminds me of a Takimag review way back of Gossip Girl (never seen it or Madmen), in which they made such complaints about its portrayal of New York as “one couple moves from the Upper East Side to Williamsburg because its more real, when in reality a loft like there’s in Williamsburg would be almost as expensive” or “the elite high schools in Manhattan are not nearly so WASP and usually half Jewish” – each of these being exactly half right, but what of it?

Law and Order, I must say, is deeply flawed though enjoyable. The way they strain to portray white supremacists and Christian fundamentalists in Manhattan! Lay on top of that their absolutely stubborn refusal to portray Jews at elite high schools! Also they have a pretty lousy understanding of terrorism.

]]> By: Kelley Vlahos http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8898 Kelley Vlahos Thu, 13 Aug 2009 12:31:33 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8898 Locklin is a buzz kill. I really enjoy the program, as I enjoyed HBO's Rome. I'm not an anthropologist, but I do work in what some may consider a "vapid 'creative' endeavor" -- writing about politics. I need to indulge once in a while in intensely drawn, colorful characters moving through psychologically taut situations whether they be historically rigorous or laced with a few false notes (Mad Men is surely sprinkled with these; sometimes they are fun to point out). So what. Did Locklin hate "I, Claudius" too? Locklin is a buzz kill. I really enjoy the program, as I enjoyed HBO’s Rome. I’m not an anthropologist, but I do work in what some may consider a “vapid ‘creative’ endeavor” — writing about politics. I need to indulge once in a while in intensely drawn, colorful characters moving through psychologically taut situations whether they be historically rigorous or laced with a few false notes (Mad Men is surely sprinkled with these; sometimes they are fun to point out). So what. Did Locklin hate “I, Claudius” too?

]]> By: KXB http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/2009/08/12/maddening-men/comment-page-1/#comment-8887 KXB Thu, 13 Aug 2009 01:58:01 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/blog/?p=2093#comment-8887 Big fan of the show, own Seasons 1 & 2 on DVD. Unfortunately, some people cannot enjoy anything, whether it is a TV show, music, or a film - without trying to fit it into a 2009 political viewpoint. If anything, Mad Men was contemptuous of beatniks, such as when Don asks one, "Tell me, if you had a job, what would you do?" With the "major" networks serving up dreck like More to Love and Wipeout, Mad Men is a welcome reminder that TV can be a venue for engaging story-telling. Big fan of the show, own Seasons 1 & 2 on DVD. Unfortunately, some people cannot enjoy anything, whether it is a TV show, music, or a film – without trying to fit it into a 2009 political viewpoint. If anything, Mad Men was contemptuous of beatniks, such as when Don asks one, “Tell me, if you had a job, what would you do?” With the “major” networks serving up dreck like More to Love and Wipeout, Mad Men is a welcome reminder that TV can be a venue for engaging story-telling.

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